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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 5:08 pm 
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Gaara wrote:
I'd completely forgot about Zonta's accident. I don't remember ever seeing a video of it but they filmed practice, so there should be footage.

Unless the cameraman missed it...

Edit: And as I say that... Cheers :lol:


I live in Brazil and that angle was never shown in any moment during the weekend, only another one that get just the start of the accident. One of the worst examples of saving the best for the paid highlights.


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 5:41 pm 
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Looks like it's going to rain on sunday :(


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 5:59 pm 
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Echti wrote:
Looks like it's going to rain on sunday :(


Damn...I just opened two tabs, one with the Monaco and one with the Indy thread, and wondered what's bad about rain....then I realized this is the Indy thread. :whistling: Rain would be a real bummer for Indy. :(


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 6:41 pm 
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Echti wrote:
Looks like it's going to rain on sunday :(
Not meant to be much better for Monday/Tuesday either.

Was it 1997 where the race was started o Monday & finished on Tuesday due to a rain delay?


Last edited by StefMeister on Wed May 20, 2015 6:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 6:44 pm 
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Damn...


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 6:44 pm 
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Sounds like Briscoe will replace Hinch for the 500

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 7:16 pm 
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StefMeister wrote:
Echti wrote:
Looks like it's going to rain on sunday :(
Not meant to be much better for Monday/Tuesday either.

Was it 1997 where the race was started o Monday & finished on Tuesday due to a rain delay?


also in 1973 and the outcome wasn't the best

the similarities are quite scary

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 7:38 pm 
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[tweet]https://twitter.com/tgruener/status/601084913698414592[/tweet]

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 7:42 pm 
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That's very good news.


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 8:01 pm 
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Excellent. And once again, a hats off to the Indycar Holmatro safety crew for showing once again why they're regarded as some of the best in the business.

EDIT: The forecast isn't that horrible yet. http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/speedway-in/46224/daily-weather-forecast/2124674?day=5


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 9:42 pm 
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I remember Jim McKay saying on the rainout in 1986 that there was only supposed to be a 10% chance of rain.

I also remember people being amazed that the 1991 race wasn't rained out, the forecast was so dreadful.

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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 10:45 pm 
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If Hinchcliffe really is going to be out for awhile, I'd love to see him join the NBCSN booth for the races. I really like Bell but he's only raced this chassis at Indy. Hinch would be able to provide some great information because of all his weekly experience in the cars. Plus, he seems the sort that would speak his mind about the goings on in general.


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PostPosted: Wed May 20, 2015 11:28 pm 
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Chris A wrote:
If Hinchcliffe really is going to be out for awhile, I'd love to see him join the NBCSN booth for the races.
That would be cool, He was great when he was doing the Champcar commentary on the international feed alongside Jeremy Shaw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2evmILBMbCk&hd=1


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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 12:36 am 
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StefMeister wrote:
Chris A wrote:
If Hinchcliffe really is going to be out for awhile, I'd love to see him join the NBCSN booth for the races.
That would be cool, He was great when he was doing the Champcar commentary on the international feed alongside Jeremy Shaw.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2evmILBMbCk&hd=1


I actually said this on downforce usa Tuesday night too so great minds.
I'd rather he was in nbcsn with his mentor tracy than dragged down by the abc dullards tho ;p

I think back then Jeremy would just scout the paddock and find anyone he could to be his commmentstor (I remember races with Johnathon palmer and the v8 supercar guy suprisingly not at surfers) then one day he picked hinch and it worked so well they team up on every race until the irl black hole had engulfed everything ccws had left.
Or a merger, they called it. Whatever :p

Still, the best news is he's going to be ok. Hopefully there will be a lot more to see from Hinch both in and out of the car ;)

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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 12:49 am 
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Beezle wrote:
Oh my, Indycar... when did you get such sisies?

Its okay to be concerned because of Helios crash, since the car lifted before he hit the wall.
Its barely okay to be concerned because of Newgardens and Carpenters wrech, since the floors of the cars were exposed to the wind by hitting the wall. Any car would go over at that speed.

They shouldn't be over concerned about cars lifting up, imho. There is always potential for that to happen with (relatively) high downforce cars:
Quote:
To start, the crash has nothing to do with aero kits. Rear blowovers like the one experienced by Castroneves have been happening for decades by cars with large underwings. It happened for the first time in the 1980s when underwings were introduced, and they will continue to happen in any form of motorsports where they’re used in high-speed vehicles.
The reason for the No. 3 lifting and flipping was due to the car’s aerodynamics working in the opposite direction they were designed to function. Castroneves entered Turn 1 on his first flying lap and lost control of the rear of the car. The three-time Indy 500 winner attempted to catch the car by turning into the slide--which initially worked – but it wiggled a second time and quickly swapped ends. The total time from pointing straight prior to the second wiggle and being completely backwards took just 1.08 seconds.

While accelerating forward, an Indy car generates significant amounts of downforce, and in Indy 500 trim, most of it comes from the wing-shaped floor. Chevy (and Honda) use relatively small front wings and tiny rear wings. The long, wide underwing is where most of the car’s downforce is generated, and with air flowing in from the front and out through the back, it functions like an inverted airplane wing and sucks the car to the ground

Turn an Indy car around at 200mph and feed that air backward through the underwing, and it will behave like a normal airplane wing and generate lift. With enough air speed, and pressure build-up in the tunnels--which Castroneves obviously achieved, lift turns into liftoff.

http://www.racer.com/more/viewpoints/it ... ar-flipped

Cars, on such situations, are always rapidly losing speed, and downforce/lift relies entirely on that. Cars will never go too high. The few meters that we saw are about the highest it gets

http://www.mulsannescorner.com/aerodata ... erg92.html
http://www.mulsannescorner.com/aerodata ... 01i01.html

You can see that the 2001 Reynard had only 1000lbs of downforce at 230mph. So, you can clearly see how that car would never lift, when turned 180º, even if still was doing 230mph(which it wouldn't. Helio's car was quite slower than that when he got 180º)

As for the Galmer 92, and assuming the lift values(at 180º) would be the same of the downforce ones(straighforward), of which it would not, it would need at least 163mph to generate the weight of the current Indycar. The lift coefficient of the car going backwards is less than the downforce coefficient of the cars going forward, so it's necessary even more speed than that, tbh

Unless they massively increase the downforce of the cars(which will never happen for a super speedway), the cars can never generate enough lift to send it dangerously high(or let's say, more dangerous than saw with HCN).
electrodevo wrote:
The other accidents are honestly not *that* unusual for the Dallara (which has that flat underbody that seems to get air a bit easier than other designs in the past).

the diffuser tunnel starts midway through the floor, so it's not a flat underbody like FIA regulated cars which have diffuser starting behind rear wheel centerline.
westracing01 wrote:
Downforce levels could be played with via the underbody ground effects tunnels and diffuser. This would keep the Dallara's ability to follow closely through the corners without having to have such a large sail under the car.

If they increase that, it will only make they lift higher, on same conditions.


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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 12:58 am 
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The cart cars Ran ground effect and Were heavy as fuck. They weren't blowing over at any speeds.

Witness the difference between Kenny brack in Michigan 2000 vs Kenny Brack in Texas 2003.
In 2000 his lola makes wheel to wheel contact with another car, nose gets up in the air then settles back down to the ground.

In 2003 his Irl car makes wheel to wheel contact, nose gets up in the air then keeps on going until it hits the fence.

If indycar wanted a temp fix for Sunday then I'm sure a shitload of ballast to weigh the cars down would do the trick.
But then you have no data on whatever is used as ballast will do in a standard wall hit accident.
will it come back and hurt the driver, will it get out and head towards the fans?

That's the predicament indycar is in atm. They can't rush a quick fix for this without causing a myriad of other problems with their sticking plaster solution, whatever that may be.

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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 4:24 am 
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codename_47 wrote:
The cart cars Ran ground effect and Were heavy as fuck. They weren't blowing over at any speeds.

Witness the difference between Kenny brack in Michigan 2000 vs Kenny Brack in Texas 2003.
In 2000 his lola makes wheel to wheel contact with another car, nose gets up in the air then settles back down to the ground.

In 2003 his Irl car makes wheel to wheel contact, nose gets up in the air then keeps on going until it hits the fence.

That's because in 2003 he was literally driving over the whole side of another car, not just the wheel.


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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 1:58 pm 
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Joe A wrote:
I remember Jim McKay saying on the rainout in 1986 that there was only supposed to be a 10% chance of rain.

I also remember people being amazed that the 1991 race wasn't rained out, the forecast was so dreadful.


When I went to the USGP in 2007, the sky was so black off turn 4 of the oval, and it was so muggy and humid, that I thought for sure it was going to bucket down. It never did.

Indiana weather is so darn unpredictable.


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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 2:56 pm 
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codename_47 wrote:
The cart cars Ran ground effect and Were heavy as fuck. They weren't blowing over at any speeds.

Witness the difference between Kenny brack in Michigan 2000 vs Kenny Brack in Texas 2003.
In 2000 his lola makes wheel to wheel contact with another car, nose gets up in the air then settles back down to the ground.

In 2003 his Irl car makes wheel to wheel contact, nose gets up in the air then keeps on going until it hits the fence.

If indycar wanted a temp fix for Sunday then I'm sure a shitload of ballast to weigh the cars down would do the trick.
But then you have no data on whatever is used as ballast will do in a standard wall hit accident.
will it come back and hurt the driver, will it get out and head towards the fans?

That's the predicament indycar is in atm. They can't rush a quick fix for this without causing a myriad of other problems with their sticking plaster solution, whatever that may be.
Problem with adding ballast is you then increase the momentum of the car in an accident which, assuming the time to rest is the same, the force on the car and barriers will increase which opens further safety concerns for the driver.


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PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 3:07 pm 
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Indy lights on track for practice now. It's 50 degrees at the track!


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