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What will happen at this weekend's race?
Vettel will become World Champion 7%  7%  [ 17 ]
Alonso will retake the lead in Championship 6%  6%  [ 16 ]
Hamilton will suffer from McLaren reliability 6%  6%  [ 15 ]
Mercedes will continue their pointless end to the season 12%  12%  [ 30 ]
Grosjean will screw up on lap one 4%  4%  [ 11 ]
Maldonado will find someone or something to hit 8%  8%  [ 21 ]
TBK'ers will complain about the circuit and endless run off 20%  20%  [ 50 ]
The race will be incredible 6%  6%  [ 16 ]
The race will be boring 9%  9%  [ 23 ]
Kimi will win again 4%  4%  [ 9 ]
NASCAR will be more interesting 6%  6%  [ 14 ]
Go Blue Deuce 11%  11%  [ 27 ]
Total votes: 249
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:10 pm 
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Mattzel89 wrote:
would be fitting to see Alonso retire with a broken gearbox later today :p



Cruel world! :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:16 pm 
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Jason wrote:
It wont be, he will get his usual 1 second plus gap within the first few corners before DRS is activated and then run away whilst people behind him are squabbling.

FYP.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:44 pm 
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Mattzel89 wrote:
would be fitting to see Alonso retire with a broken gearbox later today :p

Or Vettel to blow his engine :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:47 pm 
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After what RBR did to Vettel's car prior to the Abu Dhabi GP, I'm fine with Ferrari also exploiting the rules to benefit their lead driver.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:55 pm 
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If Webber was forced a gearbox change to benefit Vettel then there would be a fucking uproar on this forum, lol. People seem to expect Massa to sacrifice his entire weekend to aid Alonso, but as soon as there is even a hit of at RBR, shit hits the fan.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:58 pm 
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Jonathan Noble reporting the rumour.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:08 pm 
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ellis wrote:
If Webber was forced a gearbox change to benefit Vettel then there would be a fucking uproar on this forum, lol. People seem to expect Massa to sacrifice his entire weekend to aid Alonso, but as soon as there is even a hit of at RBR, shit hits the fan.


Yes and no. I don't like teams exploiting loopholes in the rules but if it's fine for one then it should be fine for everyone else.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:14 pm 
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kals wrote:
ellis wrote:
If Webber was forced a gearbox change to benefit Vettel then there would be a fucking uproar on this forum, lol. People seem to expect Massa to sacrifice his entire weekend to aid Alonso, but as soon as there is even a hit of at RBR, shit hits the fan.


Yes and no. I don't like teams exploiting loopholes in the rules but if it's fine for one then it should be fine for everyone else.


Right, but there is a difference from starting from the pit lane gets you out of Parc Ferme (which has happened numerous times since this system was introduced, just not to title contenders) and penalising your own drivers. If Ferrari had started from the pit lane because of a similar issue then that's fine. I think that loophole will be closed if it happens again. We may start seeing cars which unexpectedly go out in Q1, or low down in Q2 starting from the pit lane in order to use this idea. At which point they'll close it.

Do people have any standards? If there's even a hint that RBR don't treat the drivers equally then the tears flow and flow and the hate for Vettel is strong. But as soon as Ferrari decide that Massa has to be penalised because Alonso is bottling it, suddenly that's ok lol. If we're going to consider this acceptable then that's fine but then we can't sit and bitch when a team does it again later.

Alonso can sit and say he's fighting Newey, not Sebastian, but Vettel can also say he's fighting Ferrari. He doesn't have Webber going out and creating holes in the air for him during qualifying. And RBR sure as hell won't change Webbers gearbox to get Vettel moved. You can't have it both ways Fernando.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:24 pm 
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Webber will move away for Vettel any time,aswell Vergne and Ricciardo. We all know it.
And Fernando indeed has to fight both Redbulls,Toro Rossos,he has just Massa who will help and move away. If everyone can take advantages from loopholes in the regulations,Ferrari can do aswell.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:27 pm 
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If Ferrari change Massas gearbox, Red Bull should change Webbers thus putting Nando back on the dirty side. :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:34 pm 
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DinoMarko93 wrote:
Webber will move away for Vettel any time,aswell Vergne and Ricciardo. We all know it.
And Fernando indeed has to fight both Redbulls,Toro Rossos,he has just Massa who will help and move away. If everyone can take advantages from loopholes in the regulations,Ferrari can do aswell.


lol, Fernando is fighting 4 cars. Those pesky STRs, always taking away points for Fernando. He has it so hard. :(


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:34 pm 
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But then he's still a row ahead of where he currently is.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:37 pm 
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ellis wrote:
DinoMarko93 wrote:
Webber will move away for Vettel any time,aswell Vergne and Ricciardo. We all know it.
And Fernando indeed has to fight both Redbulls,Toro Rossos,he has just Massa who will help and move away. If everyone can take advantages from loopholes in the regulations,Ferrari can do aswell.


lol, Fernando is fighting 4 cars. Those pesky STRs, always taking away points for Fernando. He has it so hard. :(


It's not meant that way. If Fernando was starting from back the STR for sure wouldn't let him pass like he's a lap ahead as they did to Vettel. But I can say what I want,you will always think you are right and have something else to say.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:39 pm 
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I'd rather keep Massa up the front to have the chance of exploiting any problems Vettel has at the start. No problem to drop Massa behind Alonso on the last lap if that's needed, don't see that much benefit from doing that before the race even starts.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:42 pm 
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Jason wrote:
If Ferrari change Massas gearbox, Red Bull should change Webbers thus putting Nando back on the dirty side. :lol:

lmao :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:42 pm 
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DinoMarko93 wrote:
ellis wrote:
DinoMarko93 wrote:
Webber will move away for Vettel any time,aswell Vergne and Ricciardo. We all know it.
And Fernando indeed has to fight both Redbulls,Toro Rossos,he has just Massa who will help and move away. If everyone can take advantages from loopholes in the regulations,Ferrari can do aswell.


lol, Fernando is fighting 4 cars. Those pesky STRs, always taking away points for Fernando. He has it so hard. :(


It's not meant that way. If Fernando was starting from back the STR for sure wouldn't let him pass like he's a lap ahead as they did to Vettel. But I can say what I want,you will always think you are right and have something else to say.


Like how Saubers are then? Remember they were so closely tied to Ferrari at one point that the car was a photocopy that'd make Stepney and Coughlan proud.

Everyone is acting like Fernando is overcoming such an incredibly impossible feat. Even Fernando is talking about how it's not fair. Well, Fernando has a car out there making drafts for him, giving up his own qualifying runs and tyres, and apparently will now take 5 place drops just because he's not been pulling his own weight. That's not quite as one sided as people make out is it and Webbers not had to do anything close to that.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:42 pm 
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I find it funny how I always thought Barrichello was Schumacher's bitch. The Alonso-Massa relationship takes that understanding to whole different levels now.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:53 pm 
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gd49 wrote:
I'd rather keep Massa up the front to have the chance of exploiting any problems Vettel has at the start. No problem to drop Massa behind Alonso on the last lap if that's needed, don't see that much benefit from doing that before the race even starts.


It gets Alonso off the dirty side and onto the clean side of the grid.

It actually would help Massa a little bit as it would do the same for him.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:56 pm 
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ellis wrote:
kals wrote:
ellis wrote:
If Webber was forced a gearbox change to benefit Vettel then there would be a fucking uproar on this forum, lol. People seem to expect Massa to sacrifice his entire weekend to aid Alonso, but as soon as there is even a hit of at RBR, shit hits the fan.


Yes and no. I don't like teams exploiting loopholes in the rules but if it's fine for one then it should be fine for everyone else.


Right, but there is a difference from starting from the pit lane gets you out of Parc Ferme (which has happened numerous times since this system was introduced, just not to title contenders) and penalising your own drivers. If Ferrari had started from the pit lane because of a similar issue then that's fine. I think that loophole will be closed if it happens again. We may start seeing cars which unexpectedly go out in Q1, or low down in Q2 starting from the pit lane in order to use this idea. At which point they'll close it.

Do people have any standards? If there's even a hint that RBR don't treat the drivers equally then the tears flow and flow and the hate for Vettel is strong. But as soon as Ferrari decide that Massa has to be penalised because Alonso is bottling it, suddenly that's ok lol. If we're going to consider this acceptable then that's fine but then we can't sit and bitch when a team does it again later.

Alonso can sit and say he's fighting Newey, not Sebastian, but Vettel can also say he's fighting Ferrari. He doesn't have Webber going out and creating holes in the air for him during qualifying. And RBR sure as hell won't change Webbers gearbox to get Vettel moved. You can't have it both ways Fernando.


I think you're semi-misinterpreting my comment.

So far I've not seen anyone come out in support of this move by Ferrari (bar me) nor has anyone showed any compassion or remorse against Felipe being treated like this by the team. But this is a team sport and if Mark was asked to do something to benefit Seb, I'd be fine with it.

I'm looking at this rumour from a binary level. Loophole versus loophole, regardless of the scenario in my opinion neither is correct. But if one team can use a loophole in order to gain a benefit then another team should be able to do similar.

That all said, Ferrari could do all of this to help Fred but quite frankly it won't make any difference as Seb will still smoke them (and the rest of the field). :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 5:28 pm 
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Stoegi wrote:
Jason wrote:
If Ferrari change Massas gearbox, Red Bull should change Webbers thus putting Nando back on the dirty side. :lol:

lmao :lol:


I can see this Picture which shows Alonso and Massa with Rifles and there is a Big FAIL sign on it if that would happen :lol: :lol:


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