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Who will win the Hypercar class ?
Poll ended at Fri Jun 14, 2024 11:58 am
Cadillac 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Porsche 47%  47%  [ 7 ]
Ferrari 20%  20%  [ 3 ]
Toyota 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
BMW 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
Lamborghini 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
Peugeot 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Alpine 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Isotta Fraschini 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes: 15
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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 8:24 pm 
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Lynn's third sector is still the more impressive for me. He managed to grab half a second in that sector alone.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 8:30 pm 
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That was quite a lap by Estre, so on the edge.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 8:32 pm 
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So the Cadillac #2 will start in 7th ?

Or the 5 places penalty for causing the crash at Spa is for the next round ?


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 8:35 pm 
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Toto87 wrote:
So the Cadillac #2 will start in 7th ?

Or the 5 places penalty for causing the crash at Spa is for the next round ?

They'll start 7th.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:05 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:25 pm 
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Am I the only one who thinks that the Hypercars are too slow? When you watch the telemetry the cars are barely able to pass 200mph on the long straights. The LMP2 cars are only about 8 seconds a lap slower, which might seem a lot around a normal circuit but over 8.5 miles that's not really much difference at all.

The Hypercars seem to suffer from being too heavy, or at least the power output is not enough to compensate for the weight. That seems to be a theme amongst top level FIA series; the cars are too heavy.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:29 pm 
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Track declared wet


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:35 pm 
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ZeroX wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks that the Hypercars are too slow?


Yeah exactly. The thing that I dislike the most is that they nerfed LMP2 cars because they were faster than LMP1...

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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:54 pm 
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Yes, too heavy but it is what it is. Slower so that the performance window is easy to achieve to manufacturers.

Only in some early proposals weight was below 1000kg, but no one other than Toyota signed up for those rules.

Don't expect non-miniscule lap time progress in coming years as development is so limited and any gains will be neutered by BoP anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 9:55 pm 
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MotoKris1 wrote:
ZeroX wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks that the Hypercars are too slow?


Yeah exactly. The thing that I dislike the most is that they nerfed LMP2 cars because they were faster than LMP1...

Not faster than LMP1, the nerfing came when Hypercar was introduced.

Since LMP2 was dropped from WEC, the cars run +40 bhp and -20 kg in ELMS so closer to the spec used between 2017-2020. Haven't yet raced on any WEC circuits but when they do they might just beat Hypercar times.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 10:04 pm 
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ZeroX wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks that the Hypercars are too slow? When you watch the telemetry the cars are barely able to pass 200mph on the long straights. The LMP2 cars are only about 8 seconds a lap slower, which might seem a lot around a normal circuit but over 8.5 miles that's not really much difference at all.

The Hypercars seem to suffer from being too heavy, or at least the power output is not enough to compensate for the weight. That seems to be a theme amongst top level FIA series; the cars are too heavy.


The whole concept behind the Hypercar class (and NOT LMDh) was, in theory, about having top class cars more similar to top-end road going cars.

Think a modern version of the Toyota GT-One or the Mercedes CLK/CLR, which where often brought up for comparison by media while explaining the new ruleset.

Top speed isn't even an issue, since they're actually as fast as LMP1s. The differences lie in being way less aerodinamically efficient as to cornering speed (probably even less efficient than LMP2 cars) and not being able to use their hybrid power boosts at lower speeds to maximize corner exit acceleration.

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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 10:23 pm 
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fede999 wrote:
ZeroX wrote:
Am I the only one who thinks that the Hypercars are too slow? When you watch the telemetry the cars are barely able to pass 200mph on the long straights. The LMP2 cars are only about 8 seconds a lap slower, which might seem a lot around a normal circuit but over 8.5 miles that's not really much difference at all.

The Hypercars seem to suffer from being too heavy, or at least the power output is not enough to compensate for the weight. That seems to be a theme amongst top level FIA series; the cars are too heavy.


The whole concept behind the Hypercar class (and NOT LMDh) was, in theory, about having top class cars more similar to top-end road going cars.

Think a modern version of the Toyota GT-One or the Mercedes CLK/CLR, which where often brought up for comparison by media while explaining the new ruleset.

Top speed isn't even an issue, since they're actually as fast as LMP1s. The differences lie in being way less aerodinamically efficient as to cornering speed (probably even less efficient than LMP2 cars) and not being able to use their hybrid power boosts at lower speeds to maximize corner exit acceleration.

Yes, but the LMGTP cars like the GT-One were significantly lighter (probably more than 100kg lighter) and they were significantly faster in a straight line.

And the point you bring up about being less aerodynamically efficient is interesting. You are right, it reduces their cornering speed but they still seem to generate way too much drag in a straight line despite this loss of downforce. But again, that's probably related to the fact that they are so heavy.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 10:24 pm 
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it's raining and the track is wet


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2024 11:00 pm 
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ZeroX wrote:
Yes, but the LMGTP cars like the GT-One were significantly lighter (probably more than 100kg lighter) and they were significantly faster in a straight line.

And the point you bring up about being less aerodynamically efficient is interesting. You are right, it reduces their cornering speed but they still seem to generate way too much drag in a straight line despite this loss of downforce. But again, that's probably related to the fact that they are so heavy.

It is not just the weight as the cars are relatively simple aerodynamically and that again relates to the performance window idea of a BoP class, so that no extreme designs are required (vs LMP1 era) and that some brand styling can be applied without compromising performance.

The rulebook has downforce, drag and efficiency targets and they're pretty low. The cars need to meet those and but also not exceed them too much. Then the car is homologated and aero spec is basically frozen.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2024 6:44 am 
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The Fun Cup race should be today. Will it be streamed somewhere?


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2024 7:43 am 
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Lets hope this one works out.

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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2024 2:14 pm 
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Schumifan wrote:
MotoKris1 wrote:
So we can add this wreck to the "never seen - looking for footage" thread


Only chance is CCTV, no fans around there. So we're basically never going to see it

You can actually see the corner if you stand on the very far right of the spectator era at Indianapolis.

Someone caught Louis Rossi's crash and will upload it later on the internet. He hit the grass and lost it. Will keep you informed. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2024 7:23 pm 
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Thought I'd do a "thoughts and predictions" thing again. Here goes :)

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Hypercar: When you look at the time sheets from practice and qualifying, it really is anyone's guess which manufacturer is going to end up with the W. There was only 0.750 seconds covering the top 11's quickest times in Free Practice 4! But as always, after the pissing contest of qualifying is over and done with, the ability to avoid problems during 24 hours is what's really going to matter. Among what is probably the most interesting fight for overall honours in the race's history, I reckon it'll probably be the #6 Porsche or the #8 Toyota if I had to pick someone specific. Porsche is the manufacturer with the most cars entered (six bullets in the gun) and would claim their 20th overall victory in that case. Toyota had a few traumatic years of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, before dominating after everyone else left; I'd love to see them win in a stronger field. My honourable mention goes out to the #15 BMW, mostly because it's an awesome looking car with enormous design cues.

LMP2: These guys have been having cracking races for many years already! Given how great the Hypercar and LMGT3 classes are shaping up to be, it's easy to overlook the LMP2 class. I truly can't make any proper educated guesses here, so I'm just going to go with the #37 car (since it's my favourite two-digit number). For the casual and perhaps childlike fan, you could also consider the #14 purple dinosaur car; yes, it's painted to look like a purple dinosaur.

LMGT3: GT racing at Le Mans has always been really good, and there's a healthy field in this category as well. Usually I like to hope for a Porsche victory, but this year I'd like to draw your attention to motorbike legend and budding endurance racing legend Valentino Rossi and the #46 BMW. He's the silver rated driver alongside Ahmad Al Harthy (bronze) from Oman and the very fast Maxime Martin (platinum). This year's Norwegian shout out goes to Dennis Olsen who's driving something other than a Porsche for once! He's in the giant #88 Mustang.


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2024 6:48 am 
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The 2nd Lamborghini Trofeo Race is cancelled.

The problem: too many punctures in race 1.


Road to Le Mans race will now start at 10:00 Local time (was 10:30 before)


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 Post subject: Re: Les 24h du Mans 2024
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2024 8:07 am 
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Some cool graphs on this one.


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