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| 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 https://tbk-light.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=8626 |
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| Author: | Tom [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
I totally remember how none of us ever watched F1 again after it died in 'Murica. |
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| Author: | LucasWheldon [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
kill telemetry and radio to save F1 |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
1999 Spanish GP. One overtaking move. But F1 was better in the past... |
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| Author: | StanV [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
phil1993 wrote: 1999 Spanish GP. One overtaking move. But F1 was better in the past... But hey at least we had amazing sound through our tiny CTD television screens. |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
I've said it before but so much of it is the TV direction. Nowadays we get very long shots. Imagine if we could have this at every race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoHLmFjyLRQ&t=12s |
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| Author: | LucasWheldon [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
good old days when waking up early in sunday to watch races was easier |
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| Author: | codename_47 [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
phil1993 wrote: 1999 Spanish GP. One overtaking move. But F1 was better in the past... On TV. I'm pretty sure Damon Hill sneaks by someone on the last lap after they both have to let Hakkinen through. Have to check on that one but the utter surprise of something happening sticks with me to this day 
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| Author: | StanV [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
phil1993 wrote: I've said it before but so much of it is the TV direction. Nowadays we get very long shots. Imagine if we could have this at every race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoHLmFjyLRQ&t=12s Yes. At various points you can see that the image cuts out half (or more) of the sponsored banners around the track, which I assume is exactly the reason why we are seeing the shots we are seeing today. Case in point being the demolishing of the bridge over Kemmel so they could put a half-assed metal construction with "FlyEmirates" on it during F1. |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
StanV wrote: phil1993 wrote: I've said it before but so much of it is the TV direction. Nowadays we get very long shots. Imagine if we could have this at every race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoHLmFjyLRQ&t=12s Yes. At various points you can see that the image cuts out half (or more) of the sponsored banners around the track, which I assume is exactly the reason why we are seeing the shots we are seeing today. Case in point being the demolishing of the bridge over Kemmel so they could put a half-assed metal construction with "FlyEmirates" on it during F1. Of course - this is the key reason why we have the current TV angles. The sponsor banners are very specifically placed to give them maximum exposure. It's sad but it's the way it is. You only have to watch the start of the race yesterday to see that: Petronas/UBS over the start lights, Petronas in the background. Then the shot of turn one you have two Petronas adverts on the turn one exit tarmac and a big logo on the grass on the inside. Camera then switches to the outside of turn two and you see the Petronas adverts that are attached to the turn one background. Then the next shot [when Rosberg twitches], there's a big UBS logo in the background. Bottom line: $$$ for FOM (undercutting the teams) and a worse experience for fans. |
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| Author: | kals [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
Jerom wrote: Headline at the F1-article in Belgian newspaper today : F1 professionally assassinated First time I agree with them. And many other fans as well. We've had to take a lot of crap from this franchise over the past few years, but 2014 already takes the cake. Perhaps you should change your avatar, to one of you wearing your rose-tinted glasses. |
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| Author: | Artur Craft [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
Jerom wrote: Headline at the F1-article in Belgian newspaper today : F1 professionally assassinated First time I agree with them. And many other fans as well. We've had to take a lot of crap from this franchise over the past few years, but 2014 already takes the cake. I have never felt like I'm now about F1 , not even in the parade fests of the 2000s. At least it was a boring race. Now it's a cruising parade... I'll still watch FPs and Q but the races encouraged me to do something better with my Sundays. phil1993 wrote: 1999 Spanish GP. One overtaking move. But F1 was better in the past... number of real overtakes since 2011: ZERO Yeah, I know, not many people see DRS and Pirelli tyres overtakes as a farcical thing(like Alonso's on Hulk).But I respect everybody's view on this. At least I saw some moments of racing in St Petersburg yesterday, for instance, when Power dived on the outside of Takuma, risked, showed skill and took the prize. Castroneves couldn't do the same. If DRS existed in Indy, both would have overtaken Sato in a boring way, as DRS levels down the skill to pass. There is also that aspects of pushing the equipament to it's limits through the race and not being 95% of the time on the "save mode". The much more agressive sound, the sensation of speed of the cars, the slides, real battles(albeit few) all make Indycar a MUCH more entertaining series than F1 currently is. The only thing that saves F1, no matter which cars, era, track and any other thing is chuva. Other than that, F1 can only be saved with something like what Gordon Murray suggested: http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/wp-co ... -on-F1.pdf |
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| Author: | kals [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
You do realise you're contradicting your own point with the Indycar example, right? Indycar uses "Push-to-Pass", which allowed Will Power to get alongside Takuma Sato and be positioned to attempt to outbreak him. Using your argument and examples, this was also a farcical thing. |
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| Author: | Fish88 [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
kals wrote: You do realise you're contradicting your own point with the Indycar example, right? Indycar uses "Push-to-Pass", which allowed Will Power to get alongside Takuma Sato and be positioned to attempt to outbreak him. Using your argument and examples, this was also a farcical thing. Push to pass is a better system than DRS, I dont't think you can really compare them. Everyone had the same amount of passes and uses them stratigically whenever they need them during the race, thus its down to the drivers intuition/talent. Unlike DRS which is an unequal system where you get an advantage just because... |
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| Author: | kals [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
Neither system is equal or unequal as it depends on driver input. In F1, you have to get into a position to be able to deploy the system. In Indycar, you can use P2P for attack and defense. But the point stands that P2P is still an artificial aid to help produce overtaking. Or in Artur's words... a farcical thing. |
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| Author: | Jerom [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
kals wrote: Jerom wrote: Headline at the F1-article in Belgian newspaper today : F1 professionally assassinated First time I agree with them. And many other fans as well. We've had to take a lot of crap from this franchise over the past few years, but 2014 already takes the cake. Perhaps you should change your avatar, to one of you wearing your rose-tinted glasses. Sorry, those are the only sunglasses I have
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
What is a real overtake? Two drivers dicing on the edge? Because unless the circumstances align perfectly, that doesn't happen. The fastest car qualifies on pole, followed by the second fastest, then the third fastest. By the laws of logic, there shouldn't be any overtaking full stop. But there is. In the past maybe overtaking was done because drivers were on a lighter fuel load, or on worn tyres (which still happens) or when a driver makes a mistake (which still happens). DRS is a little artificial but I think the statistic I saw was that DRS passes were in the region of 20-30% of the overall overtakes. Another issue is that because the cars are so close nowadays - and the brakes are so good - you have to be X times better to overtake a rival, which is difficult. In the past the field spread was much larger and with braking points at 120m or so, the extra 2m or so is different to trying to do the same with an 80m braking zone. Plus, was there really so much overtaking in the past or is it selective memory and the constant reference to that race at Dijon between Villeneuve and Arnoux? Plus comparing F1 to IndyCar is illogical as one is a spec series in its third year of the current car, while the other is in its infancy of a very new era and a series which has a much more global audience. |
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| Author: | OS [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
phil1993 wrote: I've said it before but so much of it is the TV direction. Nowadays we get very long shots. Imagine if we could have this at every race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoHLmFjyLRQ&t=12s That lap looks so much faster because of the tight panning shots, the cameramen struggling to keep the thing in frame and tracking it rapidly - as you say much more dynamic and impressive than a wide shot with the car slowly moving towards you and then past, but the reasons you mention are plainly obvious as well. But I really enjoyed that video and much prefer that method of direction. Can come bck pls? |
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| Author: | LucasWheldon [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
plu that kind of footage always provided great material for Antti to make his great compilations |
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| Author: | maclauren [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
phil1993 wrote: I've said it before but so much of it is the TV direction. Nowadays we get very long shots. Imagine if we could have this at every race: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoHLmFjyLRQ&t=12s So glad you posted that. One of the best pieces of camera work paired up with the sheer brilliance of Schumacher on top of his game. This one is also ridiculously good. Compare that to what Tele Monte Carlo (and sadly these days, FOM) normally does for this GP. |
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| Author: | Soul Reaver [ Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2014 Formula 1 Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix, March 28-30 |
Artur Craft wrote: Jerom wrote: Headline at the F1-article in Belgian newspaper today : F1 professionally assassinated First time I agree with them. And many other fans as well. We've had to take a lot of crap from this franchise over the past few years, but 2014 already takes the cake. I have never felt like I'm now about F1 , not even in the parade fests of the 2000s. At least it was a boring race. Now it's a cruising parade... I'll still watch FPs and Q but the races encouraged me to do something better with my Sundays. phil1993 wrote: 1999 Spanish GP. One overtaking move. But F1 was better in the past... number of real overtakes since 2011: ZERO Yeah, I know, not many people see DRS and Pirelli tyres overtakes as a farcical thing(like Alonso's on Hulk).But I respect everybody's view on this. At least I saw some moments of racing in St Petersburg yesterday, for instance, when Power dived on the outside of Takuma, risked, showed skill and took the prize. Castroneves couldn't do the same. If DRS existed in Indy, both would have overtaken Sato in a boring way, as DRS levels down the skill to pass. There is also that aspects of pushing the equipament to it's limits through the race and not being 95% of the time on the "save mode". The much more agressive sound, the sensation of speed of the cars, the slides, real battles(albeit few) all make Indycar a MUCH more entertaining series than F1 currently is. The only thing that saves F1, no matter which cars, era, track and any other thing is chuva. Other than that, F1 can only be saved with something like what Gordon Murray suggested: http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/wp-co ... -on-F1.pdf I wanna like Indycars, but when I see them racing it looks like a 3 ton heavy weight truck, it may have some nice overtakes, but F1 looks way better for me, alone in the track and even when racing. Also way more happening on the tech war, not just the same UGLY cars for everybody, F1 its still 3 times better than Indy on road courses, sorry. I still like and love Indy for some reasons, but only F1 can get my adrenaline sky high. Indy just some moments each year. |
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