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Do these changes...
Negatively affect your love of the sport? 74%  74%  [ 86 ]
Positively affect your love of the sport? 9%  9%  [ 10 ]
Make no change at all. 17%  17%  [ 20 ]
Total votes: 116
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:57 pm 
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EB wrote:
cookie wrote:
Worst rule change ever. Where is the logic in this? A driver could win 5 races and not participate in all the other races and still be champion, while another driver who scored points in all races and won 4 races would be runner up with 60 points more than the champion :?


First driver's win ratio = 100%

Second driver's win ratio = below 25%

Sounds fair enough on that specific example!


But being champion is about being the best over a whole season, not just peaking with 5 wins and then doing nothing.
If someone wins the first 9 races he will be champion. But if another driver finishes 2nd in the first nine race, he would be just 18 points behind the leader. With the points system the championship would still be open, but with the most wins system the championship is over just over halfway, unbelievable.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:11 pm 
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/cancel ... nship-2009

Everyone who is not happy with FIA's decission. Go and sign that petition for a better future!

Even if it's likely that FIA won't listen to us at all this time.. I'd still like them to know what are the thoughts of the fans concerning all this..shit..

I find it rather intriguing how FIA always shits to the plate of their own supporters......how sad is that..


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:13 pm 
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In 1988 there was a similar situation.

Only the 11 best results counted. Because of this, in the end it was the number of wins that decided the world championship, even though Prost had scored a lot more points than Ayrton.

I always found that unfair back then.

And now an even worse system is going to be introduced.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:14 pm 
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cookie wrote:
With the points system the championship would still be open, but with the most wins system the championship is over just over halfway, unbelievable.


True, but in a season like 1982, there would be about 6 drivers in contention at the final round!

All the scenarios people have come up with to highlight the madness of the new system are all pretty far fetched and unrealistic. Let's just see how it pans out in reality. I have a feeling that rather than producing some controversial result, it won't actually make a blind bit of difference.

Under either outcome, there will then be loud and probably successful arguments to change the system back again, on the grounds that if it produced a controversial champion then it's a flawed system, and if it doesn't make any difference then why did we bother changing in the first place?

So panic not, people. It won't last.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:17 pm 
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aerogi wrote:
In 1988 there was a similar situation.

Only the 11 best results counted. Because of this, in the end it was the number of wins that decided the world championship, even though Prost had scored a lot more points than Ayrton.

I always found that unfair back then.

And now an even worse system is going to be introduced.


1988 was completely fair, due to the unusual circumstances.

It was clear VERY early on that the McLarens would dominate every race, and therefore that both Senna and Prost would fill up their 11 races with all 1st and 2nd places. Hence the rules of engagement were obvious - the winner of the most races was always going to be the champion.

1964 was less fair, Hill outscored Surtees in points, and Clark won most races.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:24 pm 
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This is the most disgracful rule change ever. Whoever passed this must have a good sit down and just realize what they have done as they now are considered dumb by most of the world except for a grey haired old fart who always gets his way.

What stupid rule changes are next?? No wings, one race tyres again, medals, control steering wheel, control engines.

This is not A1GP, this is Formula One, the pinacle of motorsport not some control category where a two year old kid could win.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:31 pm 
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Also with the current engine rule if someone could go for like this:

Using all eight engines for first eight races. You will stress engines a lot but you will win all eight races. After that you get grid penalty for every race(?) and are not in the contention for good positions anymore.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:31 pm 
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People would also complain if for example Alonso was out in the first 3 races because of reliabilty-problems, and Hamilton won the 3 races by luck. The other 14 races Alonso dominate, and Hamilton finishes 14 time second. Means Hamilton world champion. That was fair?


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:35 pm 
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People are making a mountain out a molehill. In reality I bet it will change very little on the surface. 2008 aside the driver with the most victories has gone on to claim the title since what? when Senna won the title in 1988? and even then you could argue Senna deserved which means you have to go back to 86 and 87 for changes of champion....despite being a moaning tit i'd say Mansell deserved the titles those years also.

Don't mention 1982 it was such an anomaly of a season I never expect a repeat ever again.
Coem Brazil. Driver X be it Kimi Raikkonen, Felipe Massa, Robert Kubica or the Brawn Pairing will have 5 Wins to someone elses 3 and have 40 more points or whatever and it will do little to make much of a difference.

Let me state now I dont agree with the rule change. I just feel these far fetched statements of Driver A getting 5 wins and retiring from 12!!!! yes 12!!! other races while Driver B winning 4 races and finishing on the podium the other 13 times are as stupidly ludicrous.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:40 pm 
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Hello everyone, just want to come and have my little rant....

Why does this happen every single time? Everything was looking SO good for Melbourne with the new regulations and the epic final race of last year but now any chance of ever having a final half as good as Brazil last year has been completely blown away by this new championship system. Like what many of you have been saying, the most infuriating aspect of this is that is has been done in direct opposition of what the fans want....AGAIN! Do FIA/FOTA even think to check any of the main F1 media outlets online to even see what any of the opinions of the hardcore fans are? The fact that they know that they can do whatever they want and they know we'll still camp in front of the TVs on a Sunday Afternoon is just so abusive and insulting. Didn't any of the FOTA representatives think, 'Hang on, the last two seasons were two of the best ever with incredible championship showdowns...maybe we shouldn't change anything after all'?

I'm just in shock. Not really because of this new terrible decision but the consistent abuse of the fan base. In fairness, the idea of a voluntary salary cap is one that I applaude - a sensible idea in these economic times when many working-class people are losing their jobs and livelihoods because of irresponsible corporate spending - and it will likely become a major equalising factor in the sport where wins cannot be guaranteed by having the biggest budget. But still, I cannot think of any other major sporting body that leaves the fans so out in the cold. No more F1Digital+....no major online multimedia service...highly questionable stewarding decisions...little or no access for real fans to the true action down the pitlane on race day...

I'll be off down to Albert Park next week and I wish there was something I could organise, like some sort of public display of frustration. But I reckon that anything we did, like unrolling a big 'F*** you Bernie' banner or getting people to sign a petition expressing anger, wouldn't make a tiny bit of difference at all - and that's what really upsets me. At least I know the rest of you have the same mindset.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 10:52 pm 
How exciting will it be to watch the last half of the season or close to it, knowing the drivers title is already over, and the teams are just looking for a Constructors championship ? It could easily happen. One team/driver gets on a roll, early and before the rest can catch up, the title is out of reach. I'm sure Bernie will LOVE the drop in ratings and viewership. I'll bet the broadcast crews around the world will enjoy saying " Remember, <insert driver name here> has already won the world championship, and we're just here to see what manufacturer will come out on top. " How about the tracks who are late in the schedule ? How will their attendance be effected, if their race is after the fat lady has already sung ?

Why does the FIA always have to be so EXTREME ? Adding some more points to 1st would have added the incentive they must have been looking for. This " Wins = Champ, no matter what they did in the other races. " is just foolish.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:00 pm 
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JohnW63 wrote:
How exciting will it be to watch the last half of the season or close to it, knowing the drivers title is already over, and the teams are just looking for a Constructors championship ? It could easily happen. One team/driver gets on a roll, early and before the rest can catch up, the title is out of reach. I'm sure Bernie will LOVE the drop in ratings and viewership. I'll bet the broadcast crews around the world will enjoy saying " Remember, <insert driver name here> has already won the world championship, and we're just here to see what manufacturer will come out on top. " How about the tracks who are late in the schedule ? How will their attendance be effected, if their race is after the fat lady has already sung ?

Why does the FIA always have to be so EXTREME ? Adding some more points to 1st would have added the incentive they must have been looking for. This " Wins = Champ, no matter what they did in the other races. " is just foolish.


If someone wins the first 8 races, he deserved to be world champion.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:01 pm 
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mclaren2008 wrote:
This is the most disgracful rule change ever. Whoever passed this must have a good sit down and just realize what they have done as they now are considered dumb by most of the world except for a grey haired old fart who always gets his way.

What stupid rule changes are next?? No wings, one race tyres again, medals, control steering wheel, control engines.

This is not A1GP, this is Formula One, the pinacle of motorsport not some control category where a two year old kid could win.


Which begs the question, where did you get the idea of a control steering wheel? Image


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:06 pm 
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All you people complain about the "medals", but I think it will only have minor effects on the races.
The real surprise in my opinion is the new cost cutting rule. It probably wont affect the team's strategies this or next year. But on long term there will be teams that will make it under the 30 million limit and that will produce some incredible interesting situations.
When will FIA control the bills and when will they allow these certain teams to benefit from the cost savings. Will they determine the amount of money spent at the end of the year and then allow the team to develope the car for next year with extended rights or what?
It seems a little bit paradox, because developping all that stuff will sure cost a lot of money so in the following year the budget cap will be blasted again. -Will we see a backmarker team first to be the one and benefit from all those technical advantages? Consequence: reversed grid (kind of).

...or will the bigger teams do something like this:

budget 2009: 200 million

budget 2010: 200 million

budget 2011: 29 million -> yeah, advanced car developement for next year possible!!!

budget 2012: 371 million (probably less, but you get the point: they spend now, what they saved the year before) -> let's build a space shuttle of a car

budget 2013: 29 million-> hey we still have that superior car and yeah, advanced car developement for next year possible!!!

budget 2012: 371 million ...

This will shake up the world of Formula 1 like nothing ever before. :o


Last edited by docronzo on Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:07 pm 
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Joey wrote:
mclaren2008 wrote:
This is the most disgracful rule change ever. Whoever passed this must have a good sit down and just realize what they have done as they now are considered dumb by most of the world except for a grey haired old fart who always gets his way.

What stupid rule changes are next?? No wings, one race tyres again, medals, control steering wheel, control engines.

This is not A1GP, this is Formula One, the pinacle of motorsport not some control category where a two year old kid could win.


Which begs the question, where did you get the idea of a control steering wheel? Image


What he means is everyone has the same one with the same buttons and that it'd be cheaper.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:20 pm 
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The major issue people are missing here anyway isnt the silly points system but rather the budget cap. Dont spend more than £30M and you have technical leeway? Erghm how on earth is that fair or feasible Mr. Mosley?


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:23 pm 
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Dare to explain?

Image

Just made this myself.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:31 pm 
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Magnifico wrote:
The major issue people are missing here anyway isnt the silly points system but rather the budget cap. Dont spend more than £30M and you have technical leeway? Erghm how on earth is that fair or feasible Mr. Mosley?


I don't think any current team is going to subscribe to that. That £30 million includes driver salaries, there is no way that any of the top teams will be able to restrict themselves to that budget.

The only current team that might be able to do it is Williams, and possibly STR if they are sold off.

What that rule is supposed to do is to is to encourage 2 new teams to come in by sweetening the deal.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:53 pm 
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The new system of points has to be the WORST decision made by the FIA. I fail to see how it will have any benefit to the sport. I cannot under stand why they can't let just let people race over the set number of races and whoever gets the most points, wins? It works with every other championship, so why does F1 have to be different? This idea that it will help increase the spectacle of F1 is bullshit, imo, okay it may be that people try a little bit harder in the last 2laps, but what about the proceeding 60 or so laps? If someones 20 seconds up the road then its hardly going to provide anything in the way of a spectacle, is it? And another thing, if someone, say wins 9 races staright, then whats the point of the other 8? The championships decided and means the other races are pointless. As far as I am concerned, this is a terrible decision and I hope it gets changed back to the points system.

On the subject of the budget cap, not too sure on that either.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:04 am 
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Magnifico wrote:
People are making a mountain out a molehill. In reality I bet it will change very little on the surface. 2008 aside the driver with the most victories has gone on to claim the title since what? when Senna won the title in 1988? and even then you could argue Senna deserved which means you have to go back to 86 and 87 for changes of champion....despite being a moaning tit i'd say Mansell deserved the titles those years also.

Don't mention 1982 it was such an anomaly of a season I never expect a repeat ever again.
Coem Brazil. Driver X be it Kimi Raikkonen, Felipe Massa, Robert Kubica or the Brawn Pairing will have 5 Wins to someone elses 3 and have 40 more points or whatever and it will do little to make much of a difference.

Let me state now I dont agree with the rule change. I just feel these far fetched statements of Driver A getting 5 wins and retiring from 12!!!! yes 12!!! other races while Driver B winning 4 races and finishing on the podium the other 13 times are as stupidly ludicrous.


Magnifico wrote:
The major issue people are missing here anyway isnt the silly points system but rather the budget cap. Dont spend more than £30M and you have technical leeway? Erghm how on earth is that fair or feasible Mr. Mosley?


Exactly. Finally someone else who isn't over-reacting like if this is the end of the world.


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