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2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
https://tbk-light.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=8297		 Page 33 of 33
Author:  phil1993 [ Wed Aug 28, 2013 6:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
Could you upload a video of that Echti? It'd be greatly appreciated.
Author:  Echti [ Wed Aug 28, 2013 7:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
phil1993 wrote:
Could you upload a video of that Echti? It'd be greatly appreciated.


Here (horrible quality though):

http://www.aehdmedia.com/F1/BEL13002.avi

EDIT: Uploaded less choppier version.
Author:  HRC [ Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
That was the moment I mentioned above. Thanks!
Author:  Tobias [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
looks like the activists are facing up to 15 years of prison in Russia :lol:
Author:  Coldtyre [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
Why in Russia?
Author:  RtN [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
Because after this failed stunt they tried to carry out a protest in the Arctic Sea within Russian territory and were caught.

Enjoy the gulags.
Author:  Coldtyre [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
oh ok

Why so much hate on them on this forum? You can enjoy motorsports, be sensitive to ecological issues, and respect people who militate for causes they believe in.

Gulag (or 15 years prison) for protests? Even rapists don't get 15 years.
Author:  kals [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
But that's old news. The activists were caught many weeks ago. On one hand, serves Greenpeace and these idiots right. But on the other hand, I'm torn on how I feel for the couple of (somewhat) innocent victims in this situation who are independent journalists. Part of me thinks they don't deserve to go to prison because they had nothing to do with the stunt, whereas the other part of me thinks you reap what you sow.

Anyway, this is piracy. This is terrorism. This is vandalism. This may seem OTT but Greenpeace acts mostly undercover and if you're storming a oilrig in the middle of an ocean and no-one knows who you are or what you're intention is, then prepare to meet your maker. And the stupidest part of this is that they did this is Russian territory. And we all know how generous they are with human rights now, don't we? ;)

The irony here is Greenpeace's complete hypcrisy. They have a lavish HQ in central London which is a very old building and completely non-eco. Plus I'm sure their board of directors drive nice petrol guzzling cars and live in energy sapping houses. I wonder how many of their employees ride a bike to work, live in wooden huts and only use candle light?
Author:  RtN [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
coldtyre wrote:
oh ok

Why so much hate on them on this forum? You can enjoy motorsports, be sensitive to ecological issues, and respect people who militate for causes they believe in.

Gulag (or 15 years prison) for protests? Even rapists don't get 15 years.


The law is the law. You break the law, you go to jail. There are plenty of foreign laws and punishments that we all might find strange and disagree with, but it is our responsibility as individuals to either not go to these places or to respect the law if we do.

My main problem is that whenever Greenpeace pulls these stunts they expect to be treated differently because of their 'cause'. No. You don't. You aren't special. You break the law, you go to jail, and that's where these protestors will be going.

To quote a semi-famous entertainer, "No sympy."
Author:  Coldtyre [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
Well yeah, but one can't be on Russia's side on this one. The fact their reputation in terms of human rights is known doesn't legitimate it.

You may call it terrorism, but it's still far, far away from the actions oil companies have done and still do in remote parts of the world. More than the arctic, check what's happening in the Amazon (Yasuni reserve, Ecuador).

When your opponent is all powerful and unreachable by legal means of any sort, you resort to such actions. I do not approve of the approach as I'm not confrontational by nature, but as long as they don't endanger human beings they will always have a lot more of my sympathy than Mother Russia or any of the oil majors.
Author:  kals [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 7:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
They break / broke the law. That's it. The end.
Author:  Tobias [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
we also have a saying here that "everyone is supposed to be aware of the laws".

I admit I chuckled reading this line:
Quote:
Eleven Nobel prize-winners have written to Vladimir Putin asking the Russian president to drop charges [...] but Putin [...] responded that [he has] no power to influence the courts.
Author:  Coldtyre [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 7:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
Ah yes, because laws are always voted to serve the Greater Good for mankind. Especially laws related to oil&gas production!

Well, case closed then gentlemen.
Author:  phil1993 [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
If you can't organise a successful protest with minimal security in Belgium, then taking on the Russians probably isn't wise.

It'd be like me unsuccessfully robbing a corner shop and then trying to steal the Crown Jewels.
Author:  LucasWheldon [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
if oil resources come to an end, Greenpeace will stop whine or they're just a bunch of attention whores?
Author:  StanV [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
LucasWheldon wrote:
if oil resources come to an end, Greenpeace will stop whine or they're just a bunch of attention whores?


They're not against oil as such. I dislike Greenpeace because most of their actions are just a bit 'out there' for me, but this cause is definitely worth getting the attention. And that's coming from someone who has a family that has been in the oil/coal-business for almost a century.

Hate on Greenpeace, but certainly do not hate on what they're protesting for, because what the major oil companies are doing is WAY worse than just some protesting.
Author:  kals [ Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
coldtyre wrote:
Ah yes, because laws are always voted to serve the Greater Good for mankind. Especially laws related to oil&gas production!

Well, case closed then gentlemen.


You are looking at it too simplistically. This has nothing to do with laws related to oil and gas production but instead about piracy and suspected terrorism. I mean if you are going to storm an oilrig in an unmarked vessel then what do you expect to happen?

What should happen is Russia should freeze Greenpeace's assets (like the boat, etc...) and let the people involved go.
Author:  Coldtyre [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
Each to their own. I reacted because I couldn't understand how people choose to laugh about it and cheer for the demise of these activists. You can root for a strict application of law without blindly hating on the prosecuted and calling them names.

BTW, my job is to build offshore O&G installations, and the arctic is where we're heading next. I can write a book on how much they're wrong if they think deep sea exploitation is hurting wildlife if done by the books. If anything, sealife trives around steel platforms.

Even then, I'm still feeling sympathy to them. Because in an all-oil world, there needs to be a counterweight of some sort. It is urgent to discuss whether we want to dig out and burn every last drop and release it in the atmosphere.
Author:  Mika Kimi [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
StanV wrote:
Hate on Greenpeace, but certainly do not hate on what they're protesting for, because what the major oil companies are doing is WAY worse than just some protesting.


This.
Author:  electrodevo [ Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2013 Formula One Shell Belgian Grand Prix - SPA
kals wrote:
You are looking at it too simplistically. This has nothing to do with laws related to oil and gas production but instead about piracy and suspected terrorism. I mean if you are going to storm an oilrig in an unmarked vessel then what do you expect to happen?


This is a case where there's not a lot to like.

I have no like for Greenpeace and their attention-whoring, often hypocritical, law breaking approach. You can have a cause you believe in and not act like a douche. They unfortunately have failed to learn from one of their few recent successful memes (the Mister Splashy Pants campaign, where -- prodded by the Internet -- they actually appeared a little bit relaxed for once).

I really can't cheer on Russia either, because Putin and his cronies are a bunch of idiots who can't run a country very well and half rule by arresting the opposition. Of course they are going to overly punish a bunch of environmental activists from the West; just as they have played up the "anti-gay protest" and "Pussy Riot" card, Putin probably hopes traditionalist / anti-Western noise sells well enough to certain portions of the populace, enough to mask the fact that this country's in a horrible decline. :yuk:

I can't cheer arctic drilling all the way. Can't discount what Greenpeace says entirely. I think in light of BP's Deepwater Horizon oil spill (Louisiana is *still* feeling some effect from that one), there is a real environmental risk. Not the oil wells themselves per se, but human laziness and hasty, unsafe construction that leads to nasty accidents. (That's before you get to other oil politics.) Obviously Greenpeace's anarchoprimitivist attitude is out of line, but neither is casual dismissal of all issues.
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