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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 7:51 am 
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There is a structural problem with antics behind the pacecar. Sudden slowdowns or excessive braking. Make it mandatory to stick 2-3 carlengths behind the pacecar and actually penalize people who ignore it.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:38 am 
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Karan wrote:
Justin Time wrote:
A bit late to the party, but there you go:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-h ... ng-923425/


I'm curious how Vettel/Ferrari will react to the question in Austria :D


I don't think Hamilton brake tested Vettel in the true sense of the word. But the odd thing was that he kept braking and bleeding speed through the entry of the corner and well past the apex too. Right when Vettel probably expected him to accelerate. You could argue that there's no excuse for running into the back of Hamilton regardless of what he was doing in the front. But what Hamilton did there was against the code and not on at all.

This isn't to excuse what Vettel did after at all, which I still believe was a stupidly careless mistake to not straighten up the car because he was so focused on wildly waving his hands at Hamilton his moment of red mist.

Just read the article again. And then watch the video again. Look at the shift lights that indicate constant speed of Hamilton and then maybe read the article for a third time. Lewis did nothing wrong. Vettel assumed that Lewis would accelerate, but he didn't. Its 100% Vettels fault.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:40 am 
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micha wrote:
There is a structural problem with antics behind the pacecar. Sudden slowdowns or excessive braking. Make it mandatory to stick 2-3 carlengths behind the pacecar and actually penalize people who ignore it.

There are rules that cover this. Hamilton obeyed them. During SC you have to follow the SC with a maximum of about 10 car lengths. When a restart is announced and the flashing lights of the SC are turned off, the leader controls the pace and he can also slow down to bunch up the field and get a gap to the safety car.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:24 am 
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They need to get the SC an escape road on this circuit. Get the bitch off the track at the start of the straight, let them go, then the SC can get back to the pitlane. Heck, even the last corner run-off would be perfect for this.

All the restarts were hairy for some reason or another. In the first restart you had a slow moving safety car in the pit road that the whole field passed at full speed. If there's a tangle then you have someone going into it sideways/flying at 350kph. I love me some spectacle, but this straight is one of the rare potentially deadly locations of the season and should really be treated with caution in restarts.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:37 am 
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Coldtyre wrote:
They need to get the SC an escape road on this circuit. Get the bitch off the track at the start of the straight, let them go, then the SC can get back to the pitlane. Heck, even the last corner run-off would be perfect for this.

All the restarts were hairy for some reason or another. In the first restart you had a slow moving safety car in the pit road that the whole field passed at full speed. If there's a tangle then you have someone going into it sideways/flying at 350kph. I love me some spectacle, but this straight is one of the rare potentially deadly locations of the season and should really be treated with caution in restarts.

I agree, this is a great idea. Although I loved the suspense after the first SC period and it was exciting to see if Lewis gave it the beans too early or not. The comentators here in Austria madefun of it and it was terribly entertaining. But I get what you mean, having the SC wait in a run off would also reduce the need to bunch up the field


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:43 am 
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Very exciting race, lots of action, totally gutted Bottas pipped Stroll at the line... oh and LOL at Vettel saying "what dangerous driving did I do" :slaphead:

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:16 am 
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That was a comical race from start to finish, but fun nonetheless

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:25 am 
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Did anyone catch Hamilton asking the team if they could get Bottas to slow down so as to create some dirty air for Vettel? If that doesn't prove Bottas is already his bitch, I don't know what is.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:32 am 
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Scotty wrote:
If you drive into someone intentionally you should be disqualified, period. 5km/h or 300km/h doesn't matter. Maldonado did it to Hamilton at Spa a few years ago and was disqualified from qualifying wasn't he?

If Vettel did it accidentally and admitted it I wouldn't mind, but I haven't seen that yet. Lets be honest he's too proud for that.


Should have been DQ'd and handed a one-race ban. Disgraceful driving, regardless of the events leading up to it.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:48 am 
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SB83 wrote:
Did anyone catch Hamilton asking the team if they could get Bottas to slow down so as to create some dirty air for Vettel? If that doesn't prove Bottas is already his bitch, I don't know what is.

No, it proves that he considers that Bottas should be his bitch.

The fact neither the team nor Bottas complied shows that he is not. Just because Hamilton says something on the radio and it's broadcasted on TV, doesn't mean Bottas or Mercedes or Charlie will take it into account.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:34 am 
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Coldtyre wrote:
SB83 wrote:
Did anyone catch Hamilton asking the team if they could get Bottas to slow down so as to create some dirty air for Vettel? If that doesn't prove Bottas is already his bitch, I don't know what is.

No, it proves that he considers that Bottas should be his bitch.

The fact neither the team nor Bottas complied shows that he is not. Just because Hamilton says something on the radio and it's broadcasted on TV, doesn't mean Bottas or Mercedes or Charlie will take it into account.

Well yea but that kind of audacity underlies the clear upper hand Hamilton has in their relationship to where it's almost fair to say Bottas is his bitch in the making atleast. It shows how little he thinks of Bottas. To him, he is nothing but a pawn he can use to his advantage when it suits him. It wouldn't be too far-fetched to imagine the team would have actually given in to his request had he really started throwing his toys out the pram.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 2:48 pm 
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Justin Time wrote:
Karan wrote:
Justin Time wrote:
A bit late to the party, but there you go:

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-h ... ng-923425/


I'm curious how Vettel/Ferrari will react to the question in Austria :D


I don't think Hamilton brake tested Vettel in the true sense of the word. But the odd thing was that he kept braking and bleeding speed through the entry of the corner and well past the apex too. Right when Vettel probably expected him to accelerate. You could argue that there's no excuse for running into the back of Hamilton regardless of what he was doing in the front. But what Hamilton did there was against the code and not on at all.

This isn't to excuse what Vettel did after at all, which I still believe was a stupidly careless mistake to not straighten up the car because he was so focused on wildly waving his hands at Hamilton his moment of red mist.

Just read the article again. And then watch the video again. Look at the shift lights that indicate constant speed of Hamilton and then maybe read the article for a third time. Lewis did nothing wrong. Vettel assumed that Lewis would accelerate, but he didn't. Its 100% Vettels fault.


His speed wasn't constant though that's the thing. Maybe you have access to some different telemetry but his speed kept dropping steadily through the apex and well into the exit of the corner, when he was expected to accelerate, at least even slightly. At least this is what the FOM onboard showed anyway. So not 100% Vettel's fault by any stretch of the imagination. I would say 50-50 at best.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:05 pm 
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FIA should use a LMP2 prototype as safety car to see if drivers can stop complaining about slow speed

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 4:33 pm 
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 5:45 pm 
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LucasWheldon wrote:
FIA should use a LMP2 prototype as safety car to see if drivers can stop complaining about slow speed


Are you forgetting that the whole point of the SC is to slow everyone down to allow the marshalls to do their work safely?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:01 pm 
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yep, and I guess they'll keep complaining if they use a faster car as SC

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:25 pm 
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Scotty wrote:
I barely believed - I didn't see the race, went to bed before it because I had to be up early for work. The night before I had a dream that Danny R won and Stroll was 2nd. The only thing that ruined the realism was that Ralf Schumacher finished 3rd and someone was driving a flying car, but uncanny isn't it?


It happened but not in our universe. ;)

Ralf is probably driving for Sauber. :roll:


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 8:52 pm 
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Coldtyre wrote:
They need to get the SC an escape road on this circuit. Get the bitch off the track at the start of the straight, let them go, then the SC can get back to the pitlane. Heck, even the last corner run-off would be perfect for this.

All the restarts were hairy for some reason or another. In the first restart you had a slow moving safety car in the pit road that the whole field passed at full speed. If there's a tangle then you have someone going into it sideways/flying at 350kph. I love me some spectacle, but this straight is one of the rare potentially deadly locations of the season and should really be treated with caution in restarts.

Orrrrrrrrrrr, hold them behind the safety car until they hit the pit entrance, instead of booking it out of there and giving them the opportunity to restart nearly 2.5km before the s/f line.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 9:15 pm 
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my dream to see the leader get a penalty for holding too much behind the safety car to get unfair advantage

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:00 am 
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hmm, just stopping by to say congrats to Mattzel for his notoriety :thumbsup:


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